chamsa

rarik hariri=
fouad siniora=
40+ billion debt=
unclean people

-- maria et fatima
 

To answer your question, israel is greedy because not only has it taken over Muslim lands it also wants more and more. It's not about living on a piece of land, if that were the case why not pack your bags & leave to uganda, since you are known to make the desert bloom maybe you can bring prosperity to the Ugandans "too".

when i mentioned the "list" i was speaking on my own behalf and not on behalf of Hizbullah. the Wali al-Faqih does not intervene in internal affairs, certainly not in places where there are no followers, like in Palestine. This is why any solution acceptable to Palestinians would most probably be acceptable for us. So you are wrong, i did not lie.
 

Thanks for answering afterall, Mr. AlGhaliboon.

Maybe you forget time has passed. To be exact: 3 generations of people born here. And, not only from "russia, poland, the usa -as so many anti-israel people would like to portrait the demography of israel,but also the descendants of 900.000 arabic jews that were fugitives exactly like the palestinians that time but nobody even cares to mention in the 'package-deal'. It would be rather awkward to pack up suitcases and leave behind 'our' middle-eastern-roots after such long time now, won't you think? What's done is done and one should make the best outta it for everybody but your 'solution' wants the best only for 1 of the victims of history by denying the right to exist for the other side : NOW.

"most probably" is the part that's scaring... it entails, among other possibilities, the right to change one's mind, according to the situation (which I, personally, think is one of taking advantage of how things proceed and jump in on it when a 'victory' looks obtainable).

If you care to continue discussion with me, and I don't wanna sound pushy, but I DO appreciate it a lot, would you care to explain HOW exactly the 'cancerous state that has to be removed' - and is part of the principles of the iranian regimes ideology - can be announced null and void in case of reaching a mutually acceptable agreement between israel and the palestinians? I mean, even Nasrallah (your party's leader and as such the one calling the bets) states time and time again without being mystic about it that Israel should be removed because that's the end-solution and there's no talking about it.

Can you Mr. AlGhaliboon not even IMAGINE that people living here don't like to be 'removed'?

Tse.
 

Tsedek, from AlG's comments on MT's blog he seems to want peace with Israel as long as it is strictly on his terms, which are ill defined and extensible as needed. Should your country fail to meet any of his demands, up to and including national suicide, relentless war is the only solution. There is no middle ground.

My impression is that HA needs Israel as its enemy to justify its armed status. Getting into a fight with Israel, for whatever spurious reasons, evokes almost Pavlovian support in the fabled 'Arab street', and renders HA beyond criticism for a while. A bit like eating the big pill in PacMan.
 

Tsedek, from AlG's comments on MT's blog he seems to want peace with Israel as long as it is strictly on his terms, which are ill defined and extensible as needed. Should your country fail to meet any of his demands, up to and including national suicide, relentless war is the only solution. There is no middle ground.

My impression is that HA needs Israel as its enemy to justify its armed status. Getting into a fight with Israel, for whatever spurious reasons, evokes almost Pavlovian support in the fabled 'Arab street', and renders HA beyond criticism for a while. A bit like eating the big pill in PacMan.
 

Tsedek, from AlG's comments on MT's blog he seems to want peace with Israel as long as it is strictly on his terms, which are ill defined and extensible as needed. Should your country fail to meet any of his demands, up to and including national suicide, relentless war is the only solution. There is no middle ground.

My impression is that HA needs Israel as its enemy to justify its armed status. Getting into a fight with Israel, for whatever spurious reasons, evokes almost Pavlovian support in the fabled 'Arab street', and renders HA beyond criticism for a while. A bit like eating the big pill in PacMan.
 

Oooops... Sorry ,didn't mean to be repetitive ;)
 

|3run0,

With my question, I was only trying to establish if it is, AT ALL, possible to change Hizbs' ideology of 'removing' Israel... I am under the impression namely they can never change (even under the most ideal agreements) because as I read over and over again Israel is on "Muslim land" ... according to them.

But most of all, I'm just eager to talk (well - write) as human to human, because I'm so flabberghasted that according to names and stickers we put upon each-other - we THINK we know by sticking them into a group - we lost track we're all JUST human and in basic feelings like pain, sadness, happiness etc., the cause might be different, but in fact, in core those feelings are just the same for everybody.

(do you want me to remove the 2 repetitions of your msg? LOL)

Tse.
 

Maybe you forget time has passed
That pretty much invalidates the whole idea of "zionism" and your whole connection to "eretz yisrael".

the descendants of 900.000 arabic jews that were fugitives exactly like the palestinians that time but nobody even cares to mention in the 'package-deal'.
Maybe if your beloved "zionists" had not placed bombs in synagogues to force the jews to emigrate to "israel" you would've had a point.

it entails, among other possibilities, the right to change one's mind
You've done it for some 60 years, and it's not allowed for us to do that? Why is it only us who should put blind trust in your "goodwill"?

I DO appreciate it a lot, would you care to explain HOW exactly the 'cancerous state that has to be removed' - and is part of the principles of the iranian regimes ideology - can be announced null and void in case of reaching a mutually acceptable agreement between israel and the palestinians?
The "israeli"-Palestinian agreement would be part of a comprehensive settlement, which is what "israel" want to avoid, you want to separate each case and isolate each Arab country one by one, like you did to Egypt & Jordan, but it won't work any more, and the more you continue your injustices and mass-murders, the more you are increasing the chances of Egypt & Jordan declaring their "peace" deal with you null & void. MUbarak's regime will SOON be overthrown, if you think dictators will last forever and ensure your "safety" (which you place infinitely higher than the safety of HUMAN BEINGS who don't happen to be JEWS), you are wrong. If your leaders are as ignorant as your media about Arab & Muslim affairs, I can ASSURE YOU you are going down VERY SOON. So it's better to make a peace deal and give up on Al-Quds, West Bank, Gaza, and accept the refugees back and live side by side in a democratic state, because if you don't, then the future might not be as bright as it would be if you DO. And let me tell you something, if you put your blind trust in your nukes, I can tell you we are willing to be martyred by those nukes of yours, how many can you throw? Do your worst, and we will see WHERE you will end up.

When we say "israel" should be removed, we mean the zionist existence must be removed, not the Jews. But I realize that such an interpretation is not popular in "israel" because it would not spread fear and it would not justify the massacres you committed against our people.
 

Mr. AlGhaliboon, would you like to deny that Israel is the land given to the Jews in the Torah and that this is mentioned in your Holy Quran as well? (As far as connection goes - plus the fact that Palestine WAS NOT a formal and official state after WWI, with no governing status.)
Anyway, that goes way back. Exactly the point I try to make. I'm NOT one of the zionists coming here out of nothing when nothing was here. Most people were BORN here and very many of them the offspring of who came from those arabic countries they had to flee. PLEASE don't start about "your people placing bombs in synagogues forcing them to leave" - First: there is not one single proof of that, and Second: the antisemitism (imported into the arabic countries from europe) that forced them to leave their homelands finally started WAYYY before Israel was ever a state (Iraq 1941 - the Fahouds - tells you something maybe, for example?)

Personally, my in-laws were put on an aeroplane by Iraqi authorities AGAINST THEIR WILL, while their son was emprisoned and being tortured in Abu Ghraib for (hold your chair) studying the hebrew language.

I have done NOTHING for 60 years. I am not even 60 years of age. Why should I or anyone else whose kin was being born here for 3 generations already outta the mess that was history have to turn the clock back 60 years. Is it not enough to be and feel responsible for what's happening HERE & NOW, in our lifetime without taking also responsibility for the acts of our (both yours and mine) grandparents? Are there not enough problems from the past that need to be amended taking into consideration the REALITY of today?

How can I survive on hate from the past while I know that's only producing hate and destruction for the future? Isn't the future more important to you than the past, Mr. AlGhaliboon? Is the Gift of Life from our Creator that cheap that we should throw it away for things that happened in the past (when we were NOT yet alive and thus could NOT control) i/o trying to make a better future in which this life can be preserved and respected as a Gift from God? (This sounds like a lecture, but I'm seriously - honest - asking you, cause this buggles me.)

You keep on addressing me as if I am the state of Israel. I'm not. I'm an Israeli living in Israel. So, as to the last part of your comment, for which my thanks you took the effort of explaining your view, I'll tell you MY opinion:
I don't think any foreigners should interfere between 'us' Isaeli's and Palestinians. Every, literally EVERY interference has harmed whatever small steps were taken on the path of trying to reconcilliate, every outsider having their own political interests at heart. So no: a comprehensive peace is NOT and won't be an answer, because that will never be. Too many 'players' - too many different demands, and none thinking of the PEOPLE (Israeli's & Palestinians) living here.

Look around you, Mr. AlGhaliboon, see this map
https://users.cs.jmu.edu/abzugcx/public/
Biblical-Hebrew/Map-of-Israel-&-the-
Arab-World-plus-Iran.bmp
PLEASE...

...tell me when you speak about 'muslim land' and that's your motivation (as I saw you write a few times 'it's founded on muslim land') - why your 'cousins' the jews are not allowed to have a tiny little piece of land, which they are even willing to split in two besides also share with more than 20% of 'non-jews' - in their own governance (because you know that the return of the fugitives and their offspring of 3 generations in a democracry like israel will lead to the same mess we see now in about every arabic country plus the PA because there won't be a jewish majority anymore)

It is not the jews that feel 'better' than the muslims (as you are trying to accentuate in your comment with capital letters) but the way you think that makes you feel 'better' - because it is NOT equal to expect another people to keep on living in dhimmitude (as was the case for centuries in arabic lands, and plzzzzz don't tell me 'media' 'propaganda' etc., I got RealLife stories from family) and not grant the same rights you think you have as a muslim to a jew: self determination in a land.
========================

I'm sorry for the capital letters here and there above, I use it to put the accent in the right place and I got no idea how to make letters bold.
 

would you like to deny that Israel is the land given to the Jews in the Torah and that this is mentioned in your Holy Quran as well?
I would prefer if you would read the Qur'an actually IN ARABIC, rather than spread hearsay.

Most people were BORN here
So being born there gives one the right to stay there, how about the million Palestinians you cleansed PALESTINE of? Sorry I guess they were "aliens" and "foreigners" who had "settled" there.

First: there is not one single proof of that
Of course there is, but you are too blind to see it, because it would shatter all your illusions.

the antisemitism (imported into the arabic countries from europe) that forced them to leave their homelands finally started WAYYY before Israel was ever a state (Iraq 1941 - the Fahouds - tells you something maybe, for example?)
Again, Jews lived in Iraq perfectly well until the "zionists" started planting bombs to "prove" that there was anti-Semitism. Check your facts, instead of basing them on hearsay. In fact, Jewish homes were defended BY MUSLIMS to prevent any British-associated elements (who were trying to get the Jews to go to Palestine) from looting Jewish property.

my in-laws were put on an aeroplane by Iraqi authorities AGAINST THEIR WILL
With all due respect, your in-laws are LYING. No one was forced to leave Iraq, and in fact there was reluctance on the part of the Iraqi government to pass the legislation allowing Jews to leave.

I QUOTE from Michael Bishku:

"Recently declassified Israeli documents reveal that despite consideratble Israeli press coverage of and public protests against the reported Iraqi executions [of Jews], Mossad agents in Iraq had communicated to authorities in Israel that the report was not true. In fct, Mossad officials had formulated plans for disinformation and actions designed to embarass the Iraqi government and speed up legislation to permit Jewish emigration."

(Mossad Files, Israeli Army Archive, 14/28, and Mossad files, Israeli Army Archive 14/29/C)

The LAW that ALLOWED Jews the OPTION of leaving the country and forfeiting their nationality was passed in the Iraqi Parliament, it's known as Law No. 1 of 1950. And the operation that brought the Iraqi Jews to "israel" was called OPERATION EZRA AND NEHEMIAH, and NO JEW WAS FORCED to leave Iraq by any IRAQI OR MUSLIM, but by ZIONISTS.

On the FACT that the "zionists" had thrown those grenades and attacked synagogues and Jewish neighbourhoods, MOSHE GAT writes:

"Referring to the bombings in its report to the Foreign Office, the British Embassy in Baghdad noted that the more plausible theory was that certain Jews, by planting bombs, tried to focus Israel's attention on the situation of the Iraqi Jews in order to ensure that Israel would keep the airlift moving quickly, and perhaps as a secondary objective to induce those well-to-do Jews who had decided to remain in Iraq to change their minds and to emigrate to Israel.

The belief that the bombs were thrown by agents of the Zionist movement was also expressed by the Iraqi Jews just arrived in Israel. The Jews were convinced that the bombs were thrown in order to hasten their departure. Had the bombs not been planted, they believed, they would still be living in Baghdad in their luxurious homes and in comfort... When the new immigrants were informed of the hanging of the two men condemned to death for the bombings, not a few reacted by saying that this was Divine retribution for those who had brought them to their present state.
(Israel State Archive, file 2563/6)

...
The Iraqi chronicler Abd al-Razzaq al-Hasani stresses in his book that, prior to the bombings, the Iraqi government estimated that no more than 8,000 Jews would wish to leave Iraq. The mass exodus - 125,000 Jews by the time the law expired - was the result of these bombings."

Why should I or anyone else whose kin was being born here for 3 generations already outta the mess that was history have to turn the clock back 60 years.
if your leaders had put an end to this mess by giving up their dream of "Greater Israel" from the Nile to the Euphrates there would've been no need I am sure, and a compromise solution might've been arrived to before 1967. Between 1948 and 1967 "israel" rejected out of hand any and all peace gestures by Arab leaders, who were willing to give up on pretty much everything the Palestinians had lost. But your leaders continued their expansionist agendas and actions, and since your leaders are elected, why should you not be held responsible? Also, how would you be paying for what happened 60 years ago by accepting the return of the refugees? Why are you refusing the return of the refugees? By refusing it you are endorsing what happened 3 generations ago, and if you are endorsing it you are responsible for it. As simple as that.

Isn't the future more important to you than the past
What is important to me is JUSTICE, and justice is justice in the past, the present, and the future, it does not change. There can be no peace without justice. We refuse to be subdued to your hegemony and apartheid and expansionism. Do you not understand this? I can see why you wouldn't, because you have internalized the superiority complex and can't see things from our perspective.

If I am talking to you, you should see it as a gesture of goodwill, AFTER WHAT YOU DID TO ME AND MY FAMILY AND MY HOUSE AND THE VILLAGE I WAS BORN IN. Do you understand? Or it's too hard to understand what it means to go to check up on your house and to find that the whole building is no longer there?? ALL THIS BECAUSE YOUR SPOILED COTTON-CANDY SOLDIERS were captured TO ENSURE THE RELEASE OF OUR PRISONERS??? You are all like that, you speak sugar and act poison.

I don't think any foreigners should interfere between 'us' Isaeli's and Palestinians.
Yes, so that your country can go on massacring them like it did in Beit Hanoun when the ARAB COUNTRIES WERE THEMSELVES STARVING THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE TO DEATH IN COLLABORATION WITH ISRAEL.

What is your point about MUSLIM land??!?! It is not size that determines what is Muslim land and what can be 'given up', it is the fact that MUSLIMS have lived there and were disposessed of it, and have the right to reclaim it, and fight for it, and we will and we will get it back rest assured. We believe in martyrdom, you believe in luxury and security, so we remained steadfast in the face of millions of cluster bombs, millions of rockets and bombs and phosphorous shells, while you were running away from a few rockets even though YOU had shelters and we had none, even though YOU had bunker buster bombs and we had none, even though you had an air force and we had none, even though you had 50,000 soldiers in our land, and we had 3,000 BRAVE RESISTANCE FIGHTERS massacring your tanks and downing your drones and halting the advance of an army that was 20 times as numerous, and a thousand times better-equipped with the most modern equipment and bombs and shells.

Your argument that "israel" would turn into yet another "Arab state" is RACIST. You are implying that Arabs and MUSLIMS are backwards, undemocratic, and so on. I know this is what you learn at school but for someone who claims she wants to see things from a human perspective, you are doing everything BUT that.

By the way, WHY does your government interfere in MY country's affairs by making statements about Siniora??!! Why should WE stop interfering in your affairs then? Go and see your own leaders' faults before bashing mine.
 

well |3runo

now you will have to take back what you said once about sanity and the absence of the conspirazoid crap..

ha ha ha
 

Mr. AlGhaliboon, I'm slowly losing the hope you will believe me but please try to get it outta your head that I have any superiority feelings AT ALL. That claim is soooo unfair while not knowing me, you just have no idea.

I'm trying to make clear my feelings that being born here for 3 generations does give one a claim on a land namely they call it 'fatherland' (or motherland, i'm not quite sure). What was done 60 years ago I cannot help (you not either) - and the injustices that were created we have to find a solution with the consideration of the PRESENT (because time did move on and a new reality came into existence) reality. A reality you cannot just think away and it's not there anymore....

You are telling ME how jews lived in Iraq while you yourself haven't lived there as jew or know one as such??? In 1934(!!!) jews were dismissed from public service and quotas came into effect for schools and universities, June 1941 in two days time the farhood killed approx. 200 jews (my brother in law was just a small child at that time and walking the market while a whole hurdle of people chased him - he was saved, in the end, by a muslim neighbor, but all the same he could easily have been 1 of those 200 )

My parents-in-law had no reason to lie Mr. AlGhaliboon. They were middle-aged people when they came here and could never adjust to the mentality (Umm Kalthoum was listened to with mesmerizing eyes staring in the distance by them, they were TOTALLY arab)

But all the same. SUPPOSE that it was true and 'those zionists' would have forced the immigration into Israel. Where does this leave the people that fled Iraq and came here? Why would they been seen as the guilty ones i/o victims as well? And, what can their offspring do about it? Their grandparents were also chased away. (Resembles something right?)

Which 'peace-gestures' you talk about between 1947 and 1967? The Nile-Euphrates tale is a fairytale. Nobody here hardly heard about it and people only laugh when it is mentioned in the context that that is being told by anti-Israel supporters as if Israel really wants that.

Of course I'm not responsible for whatever whoever did 60 years ago, neither you. We're only responsible for our own deeds of TODAY, in our lifetime. If you think that one should be responsible as a group, why is it then that on Judgment Day one has to come clean before the One & Only for one's OWN conscience? I'm endorsing NOTHING from 3 generations ago, I'm living today, being responsible for what I can do today and the reality of today - while keeping in my mind and heart that we're all equal (and also jews are - so they don't have to give in to any superiority over a tiny piece of land to whoever holds lands himself - jews are PEOPLE as well, Mr.AlGhaliboon.)

Of course there can be no peace without justice. However justice doesn't mean taking control over everything and leave nothing for others. That's NOT justice, Mr. AlGhaliboon...

Oh, rest assured that I see your talking to me as a gesture of goodwill - no doubt. I almost feel your anger through my pc-screen consuming me. So: thank you. I DO appreciate it.

I did not however lay one finger on your and your family's house. Why did 'you' ( your kinda language) kidnap soldiers that did nothing else but guard a border from THEIR side of the fence? No other measures could be taken to ask for 'your' prisoners? How many are they anyway? I dare to bet they're a hell of a lot less than Lebanese prisoners being held in Damascus, yet.... I don't see any Syrian soldiers being kidnapped by the hizb??

No I don't speak poison. Maybe it is hardly possible to you, but I assure you it IS : to read this paragraph of your message and, while also feeling the hate you hold against me, still feel pain for you. You don't trust me, because I'm Israeli so that's up to you - but this IS the truth...

~~~it is the fact that MUSLIMS have lived there and were disposessed of it~~~
as have jews, as well as in other 'muslimland' and were disposessed of their land as well without being able to ever go back there.

You believe in martyrdom, we believe in life (you call it 'cotton-candy' - I call it Respect for our Creator). However, please bear in mind that fighting for minimizing the dangers is in no way comparable with fighting for one's life/existence. Don't let that fool you...

No, not racist. Get real. I'm married with an arab. A jew, but an arab all the same. Just realistic. None of the governments around us are working better than the israeli, and some even very, very bad.... or not at all.

This government is only worried about your southern border, mr. AlGhaliboon - and since your organization in Israel is officially on the terrorlist, and since your organization has sworn to keep on fighting until israel is 'removed' it does concern Israel what is going on in Lebanon - I imagine you can understand that.

=================================

You got too much hate in you that prevents it for EVER seeing me as a human being, like you, is that right, Mr. AlGhaliboon?

:(
 

NB:
"now you will have to take back what you said once about sanity and the absence of the conspirazoid crap.."

Yeah... Kind of sad, really. I'm sure he can fit a pipeline or two i his version of history somehow.
 

Tsedek, it seems AlG operates under the fundamental axiom according to which the zionists are always to blame for whatever happens or happened. History, and facts, are to be fitted around this basic premise.

This is done not so much by lying (and he seems quite sincere), but by accepting and repeating only the facts and opinions that support his views. Everything else is lies and conspiracies. So, in a way, the lack of evidence becomes evidence itself.

You can see the results of this mentality today in Beirut. Lebanon is again circling down the drain, and yet HA is willing to sell it downriver to the Syrians to forestall some imaginary zionist takeover.

Like I said to NB, it is sad. In MT's blog AlG was very polite and seemed willing to engage in rational dialogue. So it was very disappointing to see him turn up here, being very rude and spouting all sorts of conspirazoid crap.
 

Bruno,

I am not spewing any conspiracies. Where did you see any conspiracy theories?

I am not being rude, I am simply being blunt, as I was over at Totten's blog. However, seeing how low some people can go (referring to the latest series of posts by the "guest" blogger on Totten's blog, and his cheap shots at H.A) to prove how base and hateful and undemocratic and murderous we are, I am convinced that even the most sincere efforts to find some common language with misinformed but well-meaning people, have fallen on deaf ears. It is always tempting to listen to them rather than listen to the side that is demonized on a routine basis. You people will believe and follow those who keep up their rhetoric, and who are accessible to you. You refuse to seek the views of the side that you are concerned with, unless he would come to you and tell you that it's wrong. Don't you have the curiosity to actually check if what they are saying is true, if we really are Syrian or Iranian agents? Don't you have doubts about the honesty of these people, about their agendas? This is not a conspiracy theory. I am simply disappointed that people like you take things for granted without checking them. I am willing to discuss with anyone who is willing to listen and not just hear. Sadly, I can't say that you were doing the former. We have a saying in Arabic, it translates to "it's a goat even if it flies". This applies perfectly to what you and those who took part in the discussion at Totten's during my presence there, have been doing.

If other people die, we killed them. If our people die, we killed them. Either way, we killed them. No matter what we do, it seems we will never be defined in any other way. That's sad and not conducive to understanding and dialogue.

I think that you have no right to say I am being rude after so many posts on Totten's blog in which dozens, if not more, attacked me personally and were rather rude to me. But I responded to them with kind words and respect, and pointed out their mistake.

I think you need to reassess your conclusions about me, and hopefully also about Hezbullah.
 

AlG, when you called Tsedek's inlaw a liar, you were being rude. Very rude indeed, as this blog is the equivalent of her online home, which she opened up to you to you to say whatever you want. You earned my respect on Totten's blog, but you lost a lot of it here.
 

Indeed, when you say:
"If other people die, we killed them. If our people die, we killed them"

If you replaced 'we' and 'our' for 'zionist', you get the essence of your previous comment. That is what I meant by conspirazoid. Try also 'M14' for added fun.

I for one believe that in general people are killed by their enemies, not by their friends of allies. This holds true for Pierre Gamayel, for Ahmed Mahmoud, and for the Iraqi jews murdered in 1941.
 

~~~~~If other people die, we killed them. If our people die, we killed them. Either way, we killed them.~~~~~

Because for you your 'we' is homogeneous = all the people that never do anything wrong.

As contrary to me: Between "Zionists' you got horrible people, fanatics, exremists, killers, thieves, murderers as well as very good, peaceloving, never hurting a fly people. You, Mr. AlGhaliboon wish to sweep everything bad your 'we' does under the carpet and present them as the angels of revenge - and that's why you send any prove that there are shameless spots on this self-invented 'united we' to the 'you're lying' dustbin...
 

If anything, Allahu Akbar (aka Mr. Alghaliboon) is interested in dialogue. He kept replying to you.

Even if you (or I for that matter) do not agree with him.

It's a start.