dinsdag, augustus 01, 2006

 

Definition?

Israel has to perform the worst of atrocities to achieve the highest justified goal: to exist....

If the artery of evil is not staring you in the face but hide behind innocent, peace-loving people - and dafka those people (but also soldiers) become the victims in the course of deterring that evil from getting dangerously close to their demonical goal of destroying your existence, which is a God-given right for everybody on earth, is it then still moral to defend that right?

Weapons are only smart weapons in hands of smart people. The target Israel is fighting at this moment is but a temporary target while everyone knows the real danger lies in Teheran, Damascus... and any other country whose dictator buys off his corruption and power by controllably allowing extreme religious fundamentalists to blossom and to focus on a "common enemy" rather than to risk the chance of losing his power. Why is Israel afraid to take out the heart -the artery- of that evil that poisons foreign societies from within and allows for a continuous flow of deniers of our existence, people that hate us while not even knowing us? And why does it top things off by supplying "evidence" they're "right" by circumventing this artery of evil and let the people that are being brainwashed by this evil become Israel's victims?

This is what keeps me busy lately....

So?

Tse.

Comments:
Why is Israel afraid to take out the heart?

Because they're taking the relatively 'easy' way out. Though the rhetoric, "we must destroy Hizbollah" has to lead to invasions of Syria, and possibly of Iran, if they're willing to see it through to its end.
 
When someone reaches the stage where he uses his own kith and kin as human shields, he has reached the lowest stage in Dante's Inferno, with Brutus, Lucifer and all traitors.
It's your right to defend, or else the next time, the human shields would be Israeli children.

PS: i'm lebanese
 
The problem lies with Ahmadinejad and Assad.

This is something that can only really be won in the long run through diplomacy.

It's too late for that now.
 
This is a long term thing. Those people aren't fighting to get something tangible. They're fighting because they believe it is a religious obligation to wipe Israel off the map. How can you negotiate with that?

You know why I hate this? Because I know once Israel's "walls" are breached, these guys will be merciless towards the Israelis there. They will have no ethics since their hatred is so strong and blind.

War in the olden days was glorious. You come out with your army and I with mine and we fight in an open field. No planes nothing. Guerilla warfare and terrorism cannot be easily beaten. That's why I'm afraid sooner or later extremists will prevail. They don't want life. They want martydom. How can you beat THAT?

=(

God have mercy!
 
That's why I'm afraid sooner or later extremists will prevail. They don't want life. They want martydom. How can you beat THAT?

You give them a reason to want to live.. to embrace life and what it has to offer. You make life, family, friends (and everything that comes with it) more attractive than anything matyrdom could ever manage.

Hahahahah, and that's an almost impossible task isn't it?

I don't know. Ask yourself why you love life, and what you have to live for, and start there.
 
Assad is the natural choice
PEACE To Lebanon
 
Tsedek,

As you know very well, i always opposed Violence! And as you might suspect, we are a majority of human beings on this planet to oppose this horrible invention called War, I think that the only way towards a lasting peace is True justice! I believe that the international body called the United Nations has to disappear or at least, has to eliminate this thing called " Vito", simply because no country on this planet has more rights than another country! We need a true international body! The UN that claims to be the " Heart of Democracy" is the first not to have any democracy and is the first to commit War Crimes by allowing countries to attack each other! Israel and Lebanon are at war and it's obvious that this war will never reach it's claimed goals, after this war, Lebanon will be full of Nasrallah's! What israel didn't understand till now is that in the case of it's neighouring countries, no matter how much they attack organizations and movements, they will never reach true PEACE! You know why ? simply because the Root problem is not treated! If israel gave up the occupied territories and gave freedom to the Palestinians and gave up the 10 000 Prisioners,nobody would have any reason to attack it, if israel gave up the few square meters of the Shabaa farms, there would be no reason for Hizballah to exist, if israel dismantles it's ugly settelments on lands it doesnt own,nobody would have reasons to hate it! But if you love in the shoes of a Palestinian farmer who lost his land, who saw his house getting demolished and who needs a permit to get out from his City in order go to another Palestinian city, who saw his son, his neighbour, his brother getting killed by a bullet while walking in the street, who is hated by the arab countries around him because these arab countries prefer to have good relations with israel(Jordan, Egypt)rather than care about him, who elected democratically a Government and got blaimed for voting for it! IT IS HORRIBLE! Trust me it is, meanwhile, BE SAFE!
 
CORRECTION CORRECTION , in my previous comment, at some point i said "if you love in the shoes" I have no idea where this sentence came from! It's really wierd! I probably wanted to say, "if you put yourself in the shoes of..."

Mea Culpa, Mea maxima culpa....:)
 
Ramzi, I'm honored you visited me here, I've missed you :) Thanx!

The thing is that both sides -of which I think the majority of people agree on almost all subjects for a peaceful future together- disagree on what first should be eliminated....

all the demands your mentioned of the Palestinians or the terrorattacks committed on israeli's.

Don't you think this is the essence of why we are not able to proceed in a positive manner?

Take care, Ramzi :) Stay save!

Tse.
 
Tsedek :

Things are not that easy. And whether we like it or no we find ourselves part of a bigger force that is opposing another big force.

Let me tell you why many people hate Israel :
Because it has been kiling palestinians since long. No one can deny this fact.

All the muslim world feels that it belongs to Palestine. Even the arab national movement has strenthened this feeling of belonging to Palestine and 'al-aqsa' mosque. It is not that these people 'hate' you for no reason. There are so many reasons that push them to do so and you surely know many of them.

Israel is a strong country , if it doesnt use its strength now to change the whole picture and try to create another reality ( NOT through military operations ), and winning the moderate arab and muslim voices, then no one can hope for peace in the future.

There are many jews and many Israelis who are surely NOT a part of this struggle, but their 'existence' or presence in our land surely puts them in the struggle, whetehr they wanted it or not.

Although we are in year 2006, but I feel that for most arab countries it is the mid of the history and they are ready for the worst scinarios imagind.

Israel should start searching for solutions for the Palestinian problem. Giving us our rights and compensating us for what your governments have been doing might be all what is needed to create peace that will last for LONG.

:)
 
Well Said Osaid and Ramzi,

Tse, If you read my post (link above) carefully, it answers your question on this post.

The US and world domination policies love despots and leaders that cause no real danger but encourage extremism (both Arabs and Israelis-your leaders are not dove either) because it does not want calm situations, they want to keep the region on fire because of their interests. So Assad and the Mullahs, even Muktada Al Sadr and Zarkawi (may he rest in hell) play into the neo cons agenda and are perfect to justify hard lines and domination schemas.

If they really loved Israel they could create a great solution and solve this problem. I don't want to hear about how the previous peace policies failed. There are solutions but there is no true will to setlle this conflict once and forever.

Now Peace and tell Israel if they have or had any goals, it won't succeed. After having 10% side with Nasralla at the beginning of conflict, 100% of Lebanon wants Nasralla to inflict damages on Israel...we have no sympathy for Israel action what so ever. You are very close to bombing my relatives and you are sparing no area. YOU WON'T WIM Militarely.
 
Deze reactie is verwijderd door een blogbeheerder.
 
Osaid, you mentioned something;

There are many jews and many Israelis who are surely NOT a part of this struggle, but their 'existence' or presence in our land surely puts them in the struggle, whetehr they wanted it or not.

I just wanted to ask you one thing. What exactly does 'our' land constitute? (Ignore for a second what's going on now) Would you accept any peace proposal that saw control of Jerusalem remain in Israeli hands, or does Jerusalem irrevocably constitute your land.
 
Osaid, why was Intifada II called for?

What was wrong with negotiations to obtain what you're asking for?

The impression I'm getting from the arab countries is that they hate Israel more than that they care for the Palestinians (maybe because of past lost wars?)

Tse.
 
Well, it's clear that JERUSALEM has to be part of the SOLUTION and jerusalem under israeli control is not a Solution, it's the case to say "we share it or we all give it up" and in this case, I think the only solution is to share it!
 
Osaid,
There was an attempt to find a solution for the Palestinians, It's called the Oslo Accords - It was supposed to give the Palestinians a State of their own and solve the Arab Israeli Conflict.

Instead you and your Govt. (lead by Arafat) decided to start a war with Israel - blowing up Buses, Cafes, Hotels, Malls ETC - In order to drive as much terror as you can Onto Israeli Civilians.

When we got the upper hand you suddenly started calling for Hudnas - Just to build up your Arms so that you can go ahead and blow up in our Malls (netanyah for 1)...

I know this is all your land (as you claim - but that doesn't seem to be what the Palestinians want. No what they want is to Kill Israelis - If this was a Palestinian Run State with Jews as a minority - we would most likely see thousands of Jews killed on a daily basis till you solved the Jewish Problem in Palestine - - Well I guess it's a good thing we are in control - I would hate that to be on your conscience.
 
Oleh Yahshan,

Everything you said is relevant if you want to believe the Media, Arafat was not bad at all for Israel, to be clear! But the fact that Barak couldn't sell him his plan and the fact that Sharon hated him personally made him look that bad! It's media manipulation! as for all the corruption claims and the Arms smuggling and whatsoever, how do you expect me to trust documents found by the Israeli Army ? Beware of the Media, it can CREATE a lot of facts.... As for the question of what the Palestinians Want , Trust me, being one of them , all i want is a state of my own, with my own borders and with my own freedom and just a FRACTION of what i'm asking for, admit that israeli governments have been doing everything in order to jeopardize a just peace ( Settelments, Land seizures, arrests, incursions, assassinations, Checkpoints and closures inside the westbank and Gaza,A very very Ugly wall etc etc etc....the list can go on forever) nothing in my eyes can justify the Checkpoints and the Settelments and the land seizures or the illegal ugly wall! Such things are never done by a country that wants peace! At least, israel could have built the wall on its LANDS not on ours! It's unbearable and nothing can explain it! Olmert keeps saying that he wants defensible borders, but in the case of Borders, a country has to protect itself no matter what it's borders are! Not a country on this planet chose its borders unilateraly while claiming that it doesnt have partner, Israel expects a PARTNER that will accept all it's wills and desires, such a partner will never exist, Remember a french guy called Le Generale Petin ? not a palestinian will ever be like him!
 
Ramzi,

When was the wall built???

When were all the checkpoints put up?? I know it's hard to remember so far back as 6-7 years ago but if you try really hard you might be able to remember that those things didn't really exist. Neither did the "assassinations". The Israeli Army also did not enter any of the PA cities. In fact we were pulling back from more and more areas...

As for Arafat - Im sorry - your right - when he stood in front of the crowds screaming that he will march through Haifa, and Yafo - Chanting Jihad Jihad Jihad - he was actually talking about how much he loves Israel. (that's just one little example - please don't make me crush you image of your "great" leader completely)
 
The first Checkpoints? Back in 1993... It had nothing to do with security, it was the result of the Pre-Oslo negotiations! check it with the israeli Knesset and with Makhsom watch! Checkpoints are the result of a Separation between us and israel! But they turned out to be HELL while they were supposed to be part of the solution! I really think that you have to check your information! ....FIRST CHECKPOINT, Prior to 1993! I still recall my first day on the bethlehem checkpoint....

As for Arafat, i'm the first to criticize the man, but we have to put things in perspective, Arafat was israel's BEST partner until Netanyahu decided to ruin his image! I'm not saying that this leader was the best on the planet, but for the palestinians, he is a symbol and you will never be able to take this away.... As for "Marching in Haifa"...Your leaders never stopped calling for Settelment expansions and some of them never stopped saying " Arabim la khutza!" or " Mavet le aravim"Actually your leaders never gave up the West Bank, our WestBank! You cant criticize one side and forget about the other! Don't forget that for more than 7 Years arafat provided israel with GREAT SECURITY! he sent Hamas to jail, he maintained the calm in the region until all this second intifada started due to colateral mistakes....
 
Ramzi, you're right. Arafat, treacherous person as he turned out to be in the end, WAS a symbol. He made the Palestinian issue worldly known and took it out of the shadows.

He jailed Hamas?? Are you sure? The only arrest I can remember was the socalled "revolving doors" arrest. In- and out... being put on camera as well...

Tse.
 
Tsedek my friend,

i was there and i've seen what happened when Arafat had the respect of the international community! And he did arrest the most dangerous hamas operatives while netanyahu on the other hand made a big mistake and not only made Meshaal become stronger but was forced to Liberate Yassin in order to save the peace treaty with jordan! This was what Arafat needed the least at this point of history! Then came barak who didn't have any personality for a solution....that's why arafat's picture got ruined on both sides! we couldnt stand the situation and we didnt stop seeing settelments growing around us! Then came sharon and destroyed the Palestinian Authority, leaving a power vaccuum that got filled by Hamas! Afterall, hamas should be really thankful for israel! sharon probably said " The enemy of my enemy is my friend" and that's what sharon did by attacking Arafat personally! We could have reached a solution a long time ago if israel was less stubborn on a lot of issues! Put jerusalem aside...What israel made us understand on the palestinian side is that it decides what our country will look like and who will lead it! what i would like people to understand is that we are not asking for favours from israel, all that we want are our rights, our right to live in peace and security and freedom on OUR lands with our borders that we reached by negotiations and not by walls and unilateral israeli ideas... The moment your leadership will understand this, we will have a GREAT chance to get out of this turmoil! and that's the only way to defeat Hamas and Hizballah...Remember that their claim is that Israel wants all the land and till now, in the eyes of the common palestinian, this is very true! Walls, settelments and checkpoitns are the proof! It's time for israel to stop making enemies and to start making friends....

N.B. as you have probably seen, i am putting all the blame on israel and not talking about our share of mistakes, but the idea is that Israel is showing itself as THE decision maker in the conflict ( it builds WALLS where it wants, it builds settelments where it likes, it eliminates whoever doesnt suit it's vision,it shoots whatever it wants on whoever it wants, it is the strongest side of the conflict ....) , and the price is that every mistake done falls on it's shoulders! Israel is fighting in order to impliment the 1559 UN resolution about lebanon while it is not doing anything in order to impliment resolutions about Palestine! I don't see how a Resolution can be more important than another while they all come from the same body! The United Useless Nations!
 
Dear Ramzi, those are things that are completely differently projected on this side of the conflict and, may I add, a very important issue - because it's part of the unreliability image of Arafat (and more so: his policy). I specifically, very clearly, remember the Israeli government's accusations that their numerous requests for jailing terrorists went unanswered time after time. (so, they themselves had to act upon this).

And now you are telling me a totally different story. It's not that I don't believe you, of course - but because it's like saying the Israeli's were being lied to that is bothering me because these "facts" are part of a structure they based their opinions on. We never heard about those arrests.

Maybe you and I can peel off some of the layers of truths, half-truths and lies upon which this conflict since the beginning of the Oslo negotiations has now reached the point of being further removed from each-other than ever before?

Have a look at the terrorattacks on Israeli's at the following link that were committed during the period of of sept. 1993 - Aug. 1999, please.

http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Terrorism-+Obstacle+to+Peace/Palestinian+terror+before+2000/Fatal+Terrorist+Attacks+in+Israel+Since+the+DOP+-S.htm

Especially the ones in which busses were blown up are a major part in the opinion making on the "average Israeli" that "they" (meaning the people representing the Palestinian cause) were not to be trusted. Would they have heard of arrests concerning terrorsuspects made by Arafat - it would have made a world of difference (as you can imagine showing them the integrity of the Palestinian administration).

Since I think it's a huge distrust in each-other between Israeli's and Palestinians that is the main cause for most of the gap and hostile approach between us - and this cause should be addressed in order to take it away so we are able to proceed in a positive manner without ghosts of the past towards solving practical issues - I'm trying for a long time already to get to the bottom of "facts" that were presented to the two peoples as it seems in two completely different versions, rather than trying to convince one another of the truth of one's own version. Sadly though I just don't seem to make any progress with it since literally everybody is so stuck on trying to push their own "truth" upon the other.

It is a very illogical situation: "we" (not literally you and me, but "the sides") feel that they are each-other's victim.

Have a nice day today, Ramzi & stay safe,
Tse.
 
Sorry - the url above got messed up. Here it is again:

http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Terrorism-+
Obstacle+to+Peace/Palestinian+terror+
before+2000/Fatal+Terrorist+Attacks+
in+Israel+Since+the+DOP+-S.htm
 
Israel wants the world to acknowlege the legitimacy of its atrocities?? Why? becaus they are committed in self defence? I'm sorry but Israel better check its not so historic history (i.e. 58 years is nothing in history) and lOOK at HOW IT came to BE
 
I'm sure your version of how it came to be is just as justified as the version from "the other side", ackret. But that's exactly the problem: there is not just one version and not just one version is the truth. I know how people like to hold on to what they know about it and are convinced of "the" truth. Halas, that works both ways. Meaning: there is no end to fight for your own truth while being unable to reach out and accept. Accept the now & here, for our children - so ALL will have a better future.

Tse.
 
Tsedek:
Although I do not agree with the cycle of violence theory I will say this. Check out my blog. Collective memory and national outrage are not something you can repress. I think the more liberal minded are inclined to adopt the option of letting go of the past..on both sides... but Israel's intent is to repress and crush the Palestinian/Arab resistance till it drives them out of their own homes.....I don't think they are goin without a fight
 
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